Episode 251 - Kate Williams, 1% for the Planet
In this episode of Soul of Travel, Season 6: Women's Wisdom + Mindful Travel, presented by @journeywoman_original, Christine shares a soulful conversation with Kate Williams, CEO of 1% for the Planet.
Kate Williams is CEO of 1% for the Planet, a global movement that inspires action and commitment so that our planet and future generations thrive. In more than a decade of leadership at the organization, Kate has scaled 1% for the Planet’s network to span 110 countries and 65 industries, driving more than $800 million in certified giving to vetted environmental solutions.
A sought-after public speaker and recognized environmental leader, Kate was honored as a 2025 MO 100 Top Impact CEO, named among the 2025 Top Keynote Speakers by the Real Leaders Impact Awards, and received the 2024 New Era of Leadership Award from Chief.
Kate earned her BA from Princeton University and her MS from the MIT Sloan School of Management. A dedicated connector and changemaker, she has served on a variety of nonprofit and advisory boards throughout her career. Outside of work, she’s a mom to two grown children and an avid trail runner, living in Vermont with her husband of 30 years and their dog, Maeve.
About 1% for the Planet
Co-founded in 2002 by Yvon Chouinard (founder of Patagonia) and Craig Mathews (owner of Blue Ribbon Flies), 1% for the Planet is a global organization on a mission to accelerate smart environmental giving so that our planet and future generations can thrive. Over the last decade, our network has grown to span more than 100 countries and 65 industries. Today, 1% for the Planet certification is one of the most trusted frameworks for environmental philanthropy, with more than $800 million in giving certified to date. By holding business members accountable to give at least 1% of revenue—not profits—each year, we ensure that their environmental commitments are real, verified and impactful. Once certified, members join a worldwide movement with a shared purpose: to inspire commitment and action so that our planet and future generations can thrive.
At eighteen years old, Kate Williams found herself in the Wyoming wilderness, part of a National Outdoor Leadership School (NOLS) expedition that would fundamentally reshape her understanding of leadership, resilience, and purpose. What began as a teenage adventure transformed into a defining moment for her, when her group faced an emergency medical evacuation in the remote backcountry. This moment sparked something in Kate that would eventually be part of her larger story into crafting a career dedicated to environmental impact and transformative leadership.
Today, as CEO of 1% for the Planet, Kate Williams embodies a new paradigm of leadership—one that embraces vulnerability, champions systemic change, and recognizes that true impact comes not from grand gestures of charity, but from embedding responsibility into the very DNA of business.
"Travel has this kind of change that is often quite subtle," Kate reflects, describing how those early outdoor experiences created what she calls a "muscle memory" for navigating difficult situations. This isn't about immediate epiphanies or dramatic revelations, but rather the slow accumulation of confidence, resilience, and perspective that emerges from stepping outside our comfort zones.
Adaptive Leadership and Vulnerability
Showing up as her “imperfect self” has opened the floodgates for Kate to come face-to-face with explicitly pointing out roadblocks in her leadership, taking feedback openly, and recognizing where she has areas for growth. “I do feel like my journey as a leader, I have gotten better and better at it, and I see it as being better and better at recognizing – I don't know everything. I make mistakes. I need for people to be smarter than me. I need for people to be better, and we all need for people to be better at things than me.”
Christine and Kate discuss how changing the very core of leadership in travel, tourism, and environmental sustainability will be what shifts its potential for positive impact. “You are creating the container for everybody to thrive,” shares Christine.
Adaptive Leadership is a concept pioneered by Ron Heifetz that emphasizes situational awareness, flexibility, and the ability to empower others rather than command from above.
“When I'm at my best, I'm sort of really sort of trying to show up with that adaptive quality. That doesn't put me at the center, but that puts the situation, the role, the people in the room at the center. And then, then my role is to figure out: how do I enable us to like move forward? And it may be by getting out of the way. It may be by providing clarity.”
Navigating Identities in Impact Leadership
Leading an organization dedicated to systemic change while maintaining personal well-being presents unique challenges—challenges Kate addresses with refreshing honesty in this conversation. As a leader, spouse, and parent, she's intimately familiar with the tension between the urgency of environmental work and the necessity of sustainable personal practices.
"Progress, not perfection" has become Kate’s mantra, grown from a story she shares about Anne Lamott's "Bird by Bird" approach to overwhelming or complex tasks. Kate describes how she's learned to recognize that impact work is inherently a marathon, not a sprint, requiring strategies for maintaining energy and focus over the long term. This includes setting boundaries, celebrating incremental victories, and accepting that some days will be more productive than others.
“It all adds up, and to me, that keeps me going, even though I know we’re not solving it all…the work continues. TO me, being part of making progress toward solutions matters to me.”
Philanthropy at Scale: Driving Impact
Kate breaks down 1% for the Planet’s ethos in generating impact – to the tune of over $800 million – over hundreds of thousands of donations at different levels, often going to local, on-the-ground issues.
“The way we think about impact is we have four impact areas: just economies, resilient communities, rights to nature and conservation and restoration. And you can probably hear in that that there's a very planet and people focus. That ties to our purpose, which is to inspire action and commitment so that our planet and future generations, the planet and people thrive.”
Shifting the way in which businesses think about environmental giving has transformed the potential impact of that giving. Kate shares that the organization's founder, Yvon Chouinard, established a simple but revolutionary principle: giving to environmental causes isn't charity—it's strategy. It’s taking responsibility for the true cost of doing business on a finite planet.
When leaders model vulnerability and growth, it creates organizational cultures where innovation flourishes because people aren't afraid to take risks.
In kind, when businesses see environmental responsibility as strategic rather than charitable, it shifts entire industries toward more sustainable practices.
And when impact is measured in community-level change rather than abstract metrics, it grounds environmental work in human experience and tangible results, leading to a future where both people and the planet thrive.
“If I center myself, I’m always the limiting factor on what we can attain as an organization or as a group..What does it mean to ensure that I’m creating the conditions for everyone to be as wildly successful as they can be? If I’m able to be an effective adaptive leader…then we have the ability to have remarkable teams who can go so much further than any one of us could go alone.”
Soul of Travel Episode 251 At a Glance
In this conversation, Christine and Kate discuss:
· Kate’s journey from outdoor leadership to environmental impact leadership
· Adaptive leadership, vulnerability, and authenticity
· The shift from charity to responsibility in business with community-based impact and localized support
· Work-life balance and resilience in leadership
Join Christine and Kate Williams now for this soulful conversation.
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Related UN Sustainable Development Goals
Sustainable Development Goal #6: Ensure availability and sustainable management of water and sanitation for all.
Sustainable Development Goal #7: Ensure access to affordable, reliable, sustainable and modern energy for all.
Sustainable Development Goal #10: Reduce inequality within and among countries.
Sustainable Development Goal #11 Make cities and human settlements inclusive, safe, resilient and sustainable.
Sustainable Development Goal #12: Ensure sustainable consumption and production patterns.
Sustainable Development Goal #13: Take urgent action to combat climate change and its impacts.
Sustainable Development Goal #14: Conserve and sustainably use the oceans, seas and marine resources for sustainable development.
Sustainable Development Goal #15: Protect, restore and promote sustainable use of terrestrial ecosystems, sustainably manage forests, combat desertification, and halt and reverse land degradation and halt biodiversity loss.
Resources & Links Mentioned in the Episode
Learn more at onepercentfortheplanet.org.
Connect with Kate and the 1% for the Planet team on social media! / Instagram / Facebook / Kate’s LinkedIn
Now through the end of the year, 1% for the Planet is on a mission to unlock $1 million in support for their organization through their annual Challenge Grant. Support here: https://www.onepercentfortheplanet.org/donate?form=donate.
About the Soul Of Travel Podcast
Soul of Travel honors the passion and dedication of people making a positive impact in the tourism industry. In each episode, you’ll hear the stories of women who are industry professionals, seasoned travelers, and community leaders. Our expert guests represent social impact organizations, adventure-based community organizations, travel photography and videography, and entrepreneurs who know that travel is an opportunity for personal awareness and a vehicle for global change.
Join us to become a more educated and intentional traveler as you learn about new destinations, sustainable and regenerative travel, and community-based tourism. Industry professionals and those curious about a career in travel will also find value and purpose in our conversations.
We are thought leaders, action-takers, and heart-centered change-makers who inspire and create community. Join host Christine Winebrenner Irick for these soulful conversations with our global community of travelers exploring the heart, the mind, and the globe.
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Credits. Christine Winebrenner Irick (Host, creator, editor). GUEST NAME (Guest). Original music by Clark Adams. Editing, production, and content writing by Carly Oduardo.
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Soul of Travel Episode 251 Transcript
Women’s travel, transformational travel, sustainable travel, social entrepreneurship
Christine: Welcome to Soul of Travel podcast today. I am so excited for this conversation. It's our last one of the season, and I'm very, very happy to be welcoming Kate Williams. Who is the CEO of 1% for the planet? And before we got on this call, I was just talking with my sister and telling her how excited and I was like, you know, this is like my Britney Spears or Beyonce moment.
So I'm really excited and happy to have you here on the podcast. I've had the opportunity to think for several weeks about what we might chat about, and I just, um, really look forward to being able to share your wisdom and have this conversation here on the podcast today. So, welcome Kate.
Kate: Oh, that's such a nice intro. Now I'm all embarrassed. But, uh, thank you. I appreciate that and I'm really excited to have this conversation too. I've been looking forward to it.
Christine: Thank you. Um, to be fair, I am a super fan girl of most of my guests, which is actually the privilege of being able to do this podcast is that I'm so inspired by so many of the women and why I thought this space was so needed for the podcast in general is. To create this container. So, um, yeah, just very happy to have you here.
Um, for those of our listeners who might not be familiar with 1% for the Planet, I thought we would just start with, um, giving you the opportunity to introduce yourself and then tell us just a little bit about 1% for the planet, and then we'll take into our conversation from there.
Kate: Sure. So yeah, as Christine uh said, I'm Kate Williams, CEO of 1% for the planet. I've been in this role for about 11 years. And what is 1% for the planet? We are a global movement that's focused on. On, uh, impact. And the way we do that is that we engage businesses to allocate 1% of their revenues to environmental partners, which is our sort of broad title for, or broad name for nonprofits, which go by different names globally.
So we use environmental partners, um, and it's an annual certification program, so every business member is annually allocating this 1% of revenues to the environmental partners that they select from our network. Um, and then we certify that they're doing that, giving annually, and we have businesses across the globe in about a hundred different countries, in about 65 different sectors, including travel.
And, um, it's, you know, a really dynamic and amazing, uh, impact community.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you. And I, I know that's part of why I wanted to speak with you is, you know, you're not in the travel world per se, but so many of my colleagues, um, participate and there's such a great overlap in. Kind of the ideas of responsible travel and sustainable travel and community-based tourism and the values of 1% for the planet.
So that's, that's why I, I really was excited as well as talking about kind of changes in leadership narratives. That's some of the other things I have. For later in our conversation. But yeah, that's, I just think it's a, such a beautiful compliment. Um, and the other thing that I loved as I was learning more about your story is, um, learning about some of your kind of entry points into the outdoor space and travel and, um, an experience you had with Knowles, which is something I would love to be able to speak with you about.
Um, I've had a few guests. That this was actually their kind of gateway into travel and conservation and growth and awareness, and it's such a powerful program. So I thought that would be a great place for us to kick off our conversation to get to know you.
Kate: Sure. Yeah. So do you want me to describe my
Christine: Yeah, I would love to hear about
Kate: Yeah. That's great. Well, it, it really truly has been and continues to be a really central relationship, I guess, in my life. Um, so the really most pivotal experience that I had was when I was 18 and I went on a KNOWLES course. And for any listeners who don't know what Knowles is, it's the National Outdoor Leadership School and they run a variety of different types.
Of trips all around the world. I did, you know, their kind of what was known as like the standard trip, a 30 day experience in Wyoming in the, um, western us, um, mountains. And I, um. Everything went wrong that could have, and I'm sure for all of you, like travelers listening, you know, um, how that can go sometimes, that you just have trips where the weather, the, you know, just logistics just fall apart.
And this was not because Noles was, you know, Noles was doing an excellent job, but we really just had external factors that made it a hard trip. But I really loved it. Um, I, it was new to me to be in those kinds of big mountains and. So I didn't have anything to compare it to. So hard as it was. I just thought like, this is great, and I found myself just truly falling in love with those big mountain mountains.
And also I found myself really interested in being with a group and traveling, uh, together and sort of doing hard things together. And then. Ultimately the hard, hard thing that happened was one of our instructors broke his leg and we had to do a pretty extensive, um, evacuation. And in the course of that, this is pre-cell phones, pre all of the tools that we use today to like stay connected when there we're in the wilderness.
So we truly had to send a runner group out and you. Just essentially manually do this, pretty extensive, um, uh, evacuation. And I was tasked as, you know, an 18-year-old who didn't think I knew anything with leading a part of the group for a part of this, um, evacuation. And, you know, I didn't think I could.
Do it. But then lo and behold, because I had to, I did, and that really was the seed planted for me to have this fascination with leadership and to K kind of commit in my head and heart to like, I wanted to do something with my career that had to do with wild places. That had to do with being with groups of people doing hard things.
And that had something to do with leadership, even though I didn't know kind of what all of that meant at that time. So it really was, you know, I look back at that as a touchstone moment that has. Been, you know, meaningful throughout my career.
Christine: Yeah. One of the things I wanted to, to ask you about that, you know, travel, you know, people think about travel and maybe these powerful ahas or these transformative experiences that, you know, we have the experience, we come back and we immediately. Recognize the change in ourselves, but I think what happens is more often than not, you know, it's just there's like this subtle shift and then five years down the road, 10 years down the road you'll say, oh, I see this came from this moment.
And I was just curious. For you, when you look back, you know, you kind of said it was a touch point. How did you see that kind of continue to give and evolve and transform? How you would show up.
Kate: Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's a really great point. And I think for me it was kind of both and like there was some element, which is not always the case, but there was some element for me of like, Ooh, this is an important experience. Like I kind of knew that and I was like primed for that. I was 18, I was like, I just graduated, but I absolutely didn't fully.
Understand it nor and, and some of the like understanding had yet to be made. 'cause it's like you're unpacking it as you continue to have experiences. So I think, you know, some sort of subsequent moments when I kind of realized how important it was, one was when I was I after college I became an outdoor educator in part because of that experience.
Um, because I realized like I love that it changed me. I wanna sort of continue to get to be outdoors, but also to do it in a way that kind of. Enables other people to have that experience for their benefit and for the benefit of the planet. And so I did that for a while and then when I was kind of ready to make a transition, the leadership piece really, um, you know, stood out for me.
And I looked back over my, you know, the time since my KNOWLES course and I realized that I had felt more confident stepping into leadership roles because in that course I had been. You know, identified. And again, I had kind of had the, like, what are you looking at me? Um, not that I had not held leadership experiences before, but it really was truly like a surprise that of all the people, you know, that.
You know, the instructor had said, I, Kate, I want you to lead this group up for this last section. And so I think it gave me some confidence to then have other experiences, which then, you know, enabled me to see my potential in a different way. And then, you know, I would say subsequent to that, it's been in more, um, kind of micro important moments when like there's something hard.
And I have this like muscle memory of like. No, I know how to do hard things or I know how to lead through hard things or, you know, so it's, I, I think almost without acknowledging it as explicitly, it's kind of has become just like part of how I operate. But when I do, you know, give myself space to get explicit about it, I can really see the direct connection.
Christine: Yeah. Um, there's a few different follow ups. I'm trying to think of which direction I wanna go, but I, I love that idea of being able to call on the strength that you find in travel experiences, because I think especially I, I work a lot in adventure travel and so we find ourselves in these situations all the time.
And then if you. Put them in the context of people who don't find themselves in those experiences, then you realize you actually are doing hard things, even though they feel like normal things. And I will hear, you know, I, I have this perception of myself and you know, I'm like, I'm kind of boring. I have my three kids in my job and I, you know, just do my things.
People will say, yes, but remember the time you told me you were camping in Africa and there was a hyen outside your tent. And I'm like, oh yeah, I guess I do do unusual things. So I, I think it's both things, like when someone sees something in you and reflects something you don't see in yourself because you're kind of lost in your own journey and you're like, if I can get through that moment, I can get through anything.
So I think there's. Kind of these two things that can often happen in experiences that really become catalysts for how we show up.
Kate: Yeah, I think that's such a good point. And I think also the, um, you know, the, like hyena in Africa is not your everyday experience, so there's a way that it also can, um, like you can sort of put a little capsule around it and like hold onto it in a way that like. You know, sort of metaphorical hyenas in your daily life, you're not gonna like notice or be able to kind of differentiate in the same way.
I don't think so. That is, I think one of the powerful things about stepping outside of our every day to have experiences that challenge us in new ways because it, you know, gives us the ability, I think, to see. Those challenges more clearly and sort of be able to then, um, you know, have them have like a disproportionate impact in our lives for the amount of time that they actually, you know, take up.
Christine: Yeah, and, and it is incredible how powerful, like you can kind of keep drawing at as. Drying on that reserve. And just as you were talking, I was like, it's almost like taking those moments and when you said capsule it, I was like, oh, if I could literally just have this jar with like my superpower pills that when I'm in the rest of my normal life, I can like just grab one of those and be like, okay, we're good.
It's like a Mario power up or something. Um, well you, you mentioned that out of, um, college you were really interested in the outdoors, and that's the direction that you initially went. I'd love to hear how you got from, you know, that initial moment in Knowles to 1% for the planet.
Kate: Yeah, I mean to oversimplify a little bit, but not entirely. I kind of saw that I had like two paths from that like deep experience I'd had at at Knowles and one was like to play a role in connecting other people to the outdoors, as I was saying earlier, so that they could have that gift of that experience, but also, you know.
If people fall in love with something they are, they'll protect it. So I felt like I wanna sort of create those opportunities. The other path was to sort of work on behalf of the outdoors, so more kind of environmental, you know, advocacy, conservation like broadly, um, that direction. And so when I came outta college, I went the outdoor route and then.
Um, while I was doing that, I kind of thought, well, maybe teaching generally is what I would wanna do, and then I realized I didn't actually like classroom teaching. And so I really then did, um, sort of tap into that, like the leadership piece that keeps interesting me, that keeps being like. I keep actually finding myself in leadership roles, even if I didn't say I want that role.
Like I became the head of the department in my, the school where I was leading the outdoor program and things like that. And so I decided to, um, go back to grad school as a pivot. Um, because I knew I'd had very real leadership experience, like life and death leadership experience in this outdoor program.
But I also knew perception wise, that's often not. Seeing that it's kind of like, oh, you know, you kind of worked at a summer camp kind of thing. And I was like, okay, gotta work on that. And I was like genuinely interested in learning. So I actually went to business school, um, and you know, because I really wanted to be taken seriously for, you know, and open up new opportunities that I didn't have at that point.
And after business school was when I pivoted to working in the environmental nonprofit sector. And I was still more coming at it from the angle of like. This is what I care about. Not I need to have the title of CEO, but this work and the, this mission is what I care about. And you know, at that time, this is in the nineties, so it was, there really weren't that many like business based opportunities to, if I had an impact focus.
So it didn't even occur to me to look in the business sector Today, I think there are a lot more opportunities. You know, kind of headed straight for the nonprofit sector and you know, really from there and you know, that was in the late nineties, you know, shifted into working, um. In the nonprofit sector, in conservation roles.
And then prior to coming to 1% for the planet, I spent 10 years as the executive director of another regional nonprofit that was uh, um, actually for the purposes of this audience might be interesting. It was called the Northern, it is called the Northern Forest. Can you trail a long distance Recreational paddling trail across Northern New England and um.
Just, it was a great job. I loved it. It was super interesting. It was kind of, I came in as the first, like hired, uh, ed after the founder. So I really got to do everything. It was like running a startup and that was a great experience, really challenging. Um, but I did that for 10 years, so I gained some really, you know, great experience for me.
I was a little weary after that. 10 years of running a small nonprofit is. You know, not easy. Um, and so I actually came to 1% for the planet as the director of partnerships. Kind of, I saw that as a lateral move, essentially moving to a bigger, you know, entity, bigger scope, but in a director level role. And then just as it turned out, the CEO left and, uh, the, within a year I became the, um, CEO.
So, you know, for me, really, like when I look back, it was never about. title and it, and it was more about what's the work I find myself oriented to do all day. You know, I really, um, sort of gained a pretty good understanding of what gave me energy and what took energy away and, you know, what are the, you know, what's the work in service of?
And for me, those were the kinds of the things that led me to the role I'm in now, which I absolutely love and I'm grateful for that.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. Um, as you were saying, I loved the, um, kind of the visual of the path and the, the idea of do I wanna work? In service of getting other people in the outdoors or in protecting the outdoors. And I thought, what a like, just a beautiful awareness. Of the fact that those are two different things and that they have similar energies, but that they're two different directions.
I think sometimes when we're really passionate about a particular subject or um, type of work, we, it's hard to find a distinguished between those, those different paths, and we try to do it all. Which kind of sinks us initially. Um, and then it also reminded me of a conversation I had heard that you, um, back to the Knowles trip, but just because of this line of that, you were on that mountain and kind of had a, a sense of this and you were like, I don't know what this is, but this is what I want in my life.
And I loved that so much because. I have a, like this giant sense of this and it, it's very, like, I often think of it as like this kind of like ethereal Play-Doh and it, it kind of evolves and takes different shapes, but the essence of the, this is always there. And I, I think for me that truly is like this soul of travel.
That's the thing that like energy and that that moment that when you connect with it. It, it gives you a lot of energetic clarity, but it doesn't always give you a clear path,
Kate: Yeah. Yeah.
Christine: and so I really resonated with that in your story.
Kate: Yeah. I appreciate you like bringing that out. I, uh, because that, and I do think that like, really, um. Importantly ties to like being in a environment that was not my home environment. 'cause I could, you know, again, like encapsulate. An experience that would take a lot of, like, still, like I'm still figuring out exactly what this is.
Right. Um, but I can always like attach it to, you know, those mountains in Wyoming and that like, you know, I can smell it. I know what the sun set looked like. I know that my boots were wet. Like I had, there's so many ways in which it really was a experience in a particular place. That's not a place that I.
Go to all the time. So it's really like captured there. Um, and then, yeah, I think it is it, you, you bring up such an important point in terms of like, like life path because I do think sometimes it can feel frustrating to have a this if you don't know where it's gonna lead you. And I have certainly felt that and like I can now look back and, you know, I just gave a description of how I got her got here.
That makes it sound like I knew what I was doing all along the way, which is not true of course. There's so many like bumpy transitions when it's like, where, where does this lead from? Here is, you know, what should I do from here? And so I think it's really important to name that. But the value of having something that's kind of helping you to push forward and helping you to differentiate when you get to those challenging forks in the road like.
What seems truer to, you know, the, the, this that motivates me. And sometimes getting into an experience, like when I did classroom teaching, I was like, nah, this is definitely not this. And I had to do it for two years and I was like, I didn't love it. And um, you know, I can now that feels like a little bit of a blip, but that was two years of doing something that did not give me energy.
Um, and that's as important ultimately as the stuff that you love. But, um, there are those you learn by not liking stuff as well.
Christine: Yeah. And um, I love that you mentioned that it sounds like my path, like unrolled in this perfect kind of linear way. Um, and then, you know, you know, the things that happened behind the scenes. I think that's also why these conversations are really important because depending on where you are, when you see people who you admire, who appear to be at the pinnacle.
And then you look at their journey and it looks like it flowed like that. You think you're not on the right path, you're doing something wrong or you're never gonna get there. And so I think it's so helpful to be a little bit more transparent. And I think it can be counterintuitive when you're a leader.
To say like, my path was bumpy or I went off course, or there were things I did that weren't, weren't right. Because you're trying to project this image of leadership or of experts and those things kind of sometimes don't match up like we it, I think it's really hard and we talk a lot about this on the podcast, is like how to.
To bring together humanity and leadership and those two things are often at odds. I think in the current way, we think of leaders.
Kate: Yeah, I think it's such an important point, and I do think as leaders we do a disservice when we don't share that, like, yeah, I can describe it as this like rosy path that was clear every step of the way and. If someone says that and says, that's true, I am inclined not to believe them. Because I think if you're trying to, you know, carve a path that's true to like who you are and who you want to become, um.
It's always gonna be dynamic. There's, I don't think there's any way that you can, you know, even if you know like I wanna be a doctor or, and that stays true. There's still many like sub paths and sub decisions along the way. Like I've been in the outdoors and environmental nonprofit sector my whole career.
So that stayed true. That like that, those are the core elements of the this, but the actual path through that. I heard someone once, and this would. Probably resonate actually for this audience more so than others. But like, if you push a rope forward, it's just gonna like squiggle and like, it's very hard to push a rope forward.
It's very easy to pull a rope through. And so when we look back, we can pull the rope through and it's like, oh, that's smooth. But like when you're actually living it, you're pushing it forward and it's always gonna be a little hard.
Christine: Yeah. Yes. Especially when you're pushing really, really hard and it's like, you know, that's the time to set it down a little bit. Um, I, I think, uh, I had intended to kind of end in this later leadership conversation, but since we're here, I wanna carry that through. Um. There was a post on LinkedIn, which is actually, which, what reminded me to reach out again and, and ask to have you on the podcast.
Um, you had shared a post about workshopping, a keynote with your team, and, um, about, you know, kind of the level of vulnerability of workshopping it with, you know, the people you're leading and, and this is my perception of your experience, so I'll just, this is what, how it landed on me and then. You know that you had decided that you wanted to kind of go for mastery and you were admitting it to the people around you who again, perhaps maybe should have already been assuming your level of mastery as the person running the company.
And I just remember reading that and I was like, oh my gosh, this is one of those. Stories that I think is shifting who leaders need to be in our world. And that vulnerability and that authenticity, I felt was really, really powerful. And I kind of tried to imagine myself being in that room, you know, in that space.
And I just thought. Who I am, I would be so proud of that moment to just see someone show up and say, Hey, I'm doing this thing. I, I'm not already the best at it, but I would love to be and I need your feedback to get there. Um, there's just so many parts. Pieces to how powerful I think that is. And then the other thing you had mentioned was quiet failure.
And I was like, oh, that one feels like that hits really hard as well because, um, for those of you listening, like quiet failure and the idea that if you set out to do something but you don't tell anybody else and then you don't do it, it's just like, you know that you didn't do it, but no one else does.
So it just kind of falls off. The sheet, you know, it's, it's just, it's fine that it was lost because no one was holding you accountable. But anyway, this, this moment, I just like, this is me sitting in my LinkedIn, like high fiving the airspace. 'cause I was like, I, I just love this. But I wanna hear from you a little bit about what that experience was like.
For you, and did it feel vulnerable? Did you feel like you were catalyzing a certain sort of energy in your workspace or what? What did that mean to you?
Kate: Yeah. Yeah. I, it's so great to hear that that resonated in that way. Yeah, it was a really interesting moment and it was pivotal and I didn't like go into it as like, oh, I'm doing this as this leadership vulnerability moment. I went into it 'cause I was like, oh, it would be really helpful to have my staff give me feedback.
And then when that became like the real thing that I was doing, I was like, holy moly, I'm really, really nervous about this. In the same way that like, I don't, I don't know if this is true for other people, but like sometimes I. Speaking or doing something in front of the people I know best. I feel more like embarrassed and squirmy than if I'm like, in a more public kind of, um, you know, anonymous or like just less well known space.
And so, and I think it's 'cause like you just care more. And, um, so in this case, um, you know, I realized it was, it was truly a moment of saying like, okay, I've like. And I use the example in that LinkedIn post, which I'll, I'll share here 'cause it's helpful for me is like, I am also a runner and, um, I, uh, for one marathon I, um, shared.
Publicly, like, you know, meaning like with people I knew I'm gonna shoot for this time. And then it was like, oh my gosh, now I have to tell all of them if I make it or if I don't. And so, you know, there isn't that like quiet failure. There's not the like, well I hope I make that, but if I don't I can still like come out.
Okay. So this was very similar to that because it was like sort of stating like, I'm trying to be good at this. I know I'm not there yet, so I'm gonna like show up as my imperfect self. And get feedback from you. And that's gonna help me get better. But it's also gonna be like a moment in which I'm gonna hear all of the ways in which I'm not good enough.
And, um, you know, I, my heart was racing, like all the things, and I do public speaking all the time, so I'm not nervous as a public speaker. But this, so this wasn't about the public speaking, this was about like, I'm being super imperfect in a very explicit way in front of people who I care deeply about. I do feel like my journey as a leader, I have gotten better and better at, and I see it as being better and better at recognizing like I don't know everything.
I make mistakes. I need for people to be smarter than me. I need for people to be better at I, and we all need for people to be better. At things than me. I need to hire people who are like all of those things, which when I was initially CEOI had to really work through figuring out, like, wait a second. Is it a weakness if I'm not as good at that?
You know, I, all of that. I think I've definitely been on a journey of figuring that out. This was like, you know, another, um, step in that journey and it's, it, I think it ended up again, I was really, I came into it from a, like, this'll be a great way to workshop this speech. I think I came out of it with, uh.
That was an amazing way to workshop this speech, and it was a really profound leadership moment. Um, and I, you know, I, so I got that like the second benefit, which I think is important, that it wasn't like the intended benefit. 'cause it wasn't like a constructed situation. It was like, no, I'm just like absolutely, truly a hundred percent vulnerable in this moment.
And I, it's, if I had known that, I may not have suggested this, but I'm really glad I did because. It was just, there was a, a really nice sort of warmth and connection with my team that like grew from there.
Christine: Yeah. I thank you for sharing that and I, for me, I just, I felt like. When I'm looking for people that I wanna look up to in leadership roles, these are those moments where I think, oh, this is defining something differently for me. And so that's why I think it really resonated and I've been spending a lot of time this year thinking about kind. How business needs to evolve, how tourism needs to evolve to be better for the world. And again, there's probably a lot of overlap here between, you know, 1% for the planet and the what you're trying to create. But it really starts with kind of changing some of these systems. And that starts, I think, with changing leaders.
Like we have had this idea at some point that leadership is like. Expert and control, and I am the best. So like, follow me, listen to me. I'm leading and really, and I, I just had a beautiful interview last week with someone who's saying, you know, the best leader is the best listener in the room. And I just thought, yes, that.
Truly, I think some of the best leaders are invisible and that they are, like you said, watching everybody. You are like noticing everybody's strengths and weaknesses. You are creating the container for everybody to thrive. And I think it's really hard because. The narrative of leader puts a lot of people who have been driven, not rightly or wrongly, but by ego and thinking they can do it best and then to all of a sudden have to say, I might not know best is a really far leap.
Um, but I would love to just kind of hear from you on like, what do you think the evolution of leadership looks like and how that will evolve. Business for better.
Kate: Yeah. And it's great to hear you describing some of that. 'cause I agree with a lot of that. I would say like my, like asterisk on that as I would add, I, I would or I wouldn't. I wouldn't change any of that, but I would sort of put it in a framework of adaptive leadership, which, you know, you can lowercase a, that can be just like English language.
There is a um, uh, academic Ron Hefe who's done some work on adaptive leadership. And I think to me, I think about that a lot because it's really like assessing in every moment what is, what's called for in this sit situation. What does it look like to lead in this situation? So actually like going back to my Knowles experience.
In a moment of like an instructor breaking his leg and you have to do a, an evacuation. We needed our course leader to be like, Kate, you do this, we're gonna do that. Like there, this was not a time for a ton of listening and, you know, working through it, but, you know, many of the other instances, um, it was absolutely, you know, like.
We could go up there, we could go up there like, what's your idea? What's your strength? You know, all of that. So I do think, you know, when I'm at my best, I'm sort of really sort of trying to show up with that adaptive quality. That's doesn't put me at the center, but that puts. The situation, the role, the people in the room at the center.
And then, then my role is to figure out like how do I enable us to like move forward? And it may be by getting out of the way. It may be by providing clarity. It may be in some instances if it's a crisis or if it's a. Just one of those moments where like a decision needs to be made that, you know, that may be it.
So I would say, like, for me, really thinking about adaptive leadership, I think also for me, like, and it's an ongoing process, really, really letting go of thinking that there's a, like there where you figured it all out, um, and getting, and there's, there's some comfort in realizing that, that it's like, oh.
It ne the it, the goal never was to be the one who knew everything. The goal never was to, um, have all the answers. The goal is to continue to learn, to pull through experiences, like hopefully I can add value through that. But the value you add isn't just a measure of like what, you know, it's, you know, your ability to continue to meet the situation.
Again, that adaptive leadership and like one of the ways I also think about it is. If I center myself, I'm always the limiting factor on what we can attain as an organization or as a group. And like, even as a, uh, newer CEO where I was, you know, just struggling a lot more with like confidence and ego and things like that.
I had that awareness of like. That just never would work. 'cause like little old me like that, that's definitely less than what we can do. And I've always been a team person, so I sort of understand the power of teams. But so then really bringing that into practice, what does it mean to ensure that I'm creating the conditions for everyone to be as wildly successful as they can be.
And so then we can. You know, sky's the limit. So that's another piece of it. Like if I'm able to be an effective adaptive leader that isn't putting myself at the center, then we have the ability to like have like remarkable teams who can go so much further than any one of us could go alone.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you. I love that. And, and I really appreciate the asterisk that you added. 'cause I, I, I agree. Like there are definitely different times when. Different leadership styles are essential and will work best. And I, I think I was only thinking in the moment about how common that type of leadership style is, but yes, like being aware of the places when we need the different type of leaders and opening that up to be a little bit more.
Uh, adaptive and, and realize what is necessary in the moment. And I think that's a, a real skill because like, as you said, there's gonna be the moment where you're not the answer. And I just think that's, that's the, that's a real hard part as a leader because of the cultural context around you have the answers.
That's why you're in this position. And so I, I think it's just such a, um. It, it always is inspiring to me when I see people who navigate that and, and do that with a lot of grace and seem like, you know, they still feel powerful and strong and can recognize, you know, what others have to give.
Kate: Absolutely. And you know, we're humans every day just like everyone else. So like, have days where it's like, hmm, got that totally wrong. And then, you know, then the, um, opportunity is in, you know, owning it or like having built a team where people are like, yeah, that, like that wasn't our, as good as it gets, but like, we know that we come back from stuff like that.
And so, um. I think it's, it is a, it is an ongoing journey. Never ends.
Christine: Yeah. Um, well, one of the other things I wanted to speak with you about is kind of how we can find the, the balance and the. Strength, I guess, to kind of stick to our this because when we have that, it's a strong driving force, especially if we've currently found the place that we're funneling it. And you know, many of my guests and listeners are women who run impact driven businesses and are really focused on creating positive change.
And so like we're in the middle of constantly looking at. What needs to be done and we're seeing where the world is going wrong and we're seeing, you know. Hearts breaking and we're, we're in the middle of all of this and often we're pushing really, really hard because we wanna create change. So then our cups running low and, and we still see like the finish line is never ending.
So I'm just wondering for you, 'cause I feel like you probably, especially where you're sitting, have such a broad view of all that needs to be done and can see where gaps are and you're, you know, you're pushing the pieces around like the rest of us trying to make. A change and an impact. What, what kind of in that way holds you back and what have you found that helps you keep your center and allows you to move forward?
Kate: Mm-hmm.
Christine: I.
Kate: Such an important question. Um. You know, and like looking back, I do wanna just acknowledge, 'cause I imagine this is the case for a lot of listeners, like when I had young kids still at home, I particularly felt the squeeze. Um, and you know, just wanna acknowledge that. 'cause for a lot of women, like, you know, building a career and sticking with it and sticking with your, this.
You know, you're also feeling the, and I, or I'll use myself, like I felt the tension of like being super committed to. Impact in the world and like building that and super committed to my family and not feeling always like I could square those two things. So I just wanna acknowledge that 'cause I look back on that time.
My kids are now, um, grown and out of the house, so it's very different. But, um. Navigating that particular period has its, has its own challenges and so like just strength to everyone doing that. I will say that for me, staying the course as a professional, even though sometimes I was like, oh, I wish I could be one of those people who didn't have to work as much as I do, even though I loved my work.
So I knew I didn't really think that, but. Had all those like internal loops and it just wasn't an opportunity or an option for us financially, which I'm actually really grateful for because, um, at this stage in my life, to have a really full on fulfilling career is amazing and I'm psyched about that.
But anyway, just wanna like, acknowledge that because I do think, um, similarly to like. Giving the, you know, false impression that there's like a clear path from like start to finish. I wanna make sure I also acknowledge just that the particular challenges of, um, navigating I, you know, immediate sort of physical needs of families, um, is real.
Um, in terms of like just where I am now and sort of navigating like big challenges, never enough hours in the day. Like all the things I, um. You know, some days I don't, I, you know, feel tired and overwhelmed. I will say most of the time I am pretty, I have developed a pretty good ability to, um. Kind of understand that I can do what I can do in a day and then I'll get to do more the next day.
I'm a, uh, my team knows that like I'm a big, uh, one of my mottos is Bird by Bird, which is a book by Annie Lamott, and it's about writing, but it's, um, uh, her brother was sitting at a, his kitchen table and he'd procrastinated on a book report and it was about birds and is. Dad's advice to him was like, well, there's only one day to do it, one way to do it, which is bird by bird.
And so I do sometimes kind of almost chant that to myself if I'm like, what do I need to, you know, focus on, um, so, you know, having some good kind of practices and habits around just how you navigate your day and how you kind of think about productivity. I think that has been important for me. And then, um.
I'm also a big believer in progress, not perfection, like that's the sort of a larger kind of motto of 1% for the planet. Not like a public motto, but like something we really believe is like, um, making progress in a day, in an impact area in a year, you know? Incremental progress adds up. And you know, I think sometimes there can be this like pressure to like do the big thing or don't do it at all.
And that to me is where paralysis and overwhelm happens is when you're sort of thinking I can only do the, the sort of big thing and if I don't do that, I might as well not do anything. And I like absolutely don't believe that. I believe we only get to the big things when we do. Whatever little things we can do, you know, on the path there.
So again, like back to when we had really young kids, I remember we were like, if you can get out for a five minute run, do it. That counts. Um, and then you, 'cause you're continuing to be someone who gets exercise and both my husband and I like did that and that was great and sometimes it literally was five minutes and then you come back to a crying little child and, uh, but you'd have that little bit of, um, you know, knowledge about yourself.
So. Bird by bird progress, not perfection. And then I also am like, I gain so much energy from people. And so the 1% for the Planet network is a gift. It's amazing businesses, amazing nonprofits who are working hard, being creative, taking action. Sometimes it's really small action, sometimes it's big action, but it all adds up.
And, and to me that, um, keeps me going even when I know we're not. Solving it all. We're not a silver bullet. We're not, you know, the, the, the work continues. But to me, being part of making progress towards solutions matters and, and counts for me.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you for, for sharing that and I love that you kind of talked about this idea of the, the small and incremental changes that add up over time. 'cause I remember at first when I heard about 1% for the planet, however long that go. That was, and at the same time I was working in responsible tourism and sustainable travel.
You know, I, I guess it was probably almost 20, 25 years ago and it was, you know. The conversations we were having, the energy that was around these types of discussions was so different that the amount of people who could have the conversation and when I would say, I have a degree in sustainable destination management, the number of people at that time that would just look at me like, I have no idea what you said to today.
If I say the same thing, like there's. That and that this idea that like the, just like a little bit, put the little bit down and then take another step forward. I feel like I've been doing that for a very long time. Um, but then it reminded me like, I really think of this a lot. Like 1%. It's just, it's just 1%.
That's like so little, I mean seemingly little. And yet it's huge, right? It can make a huge impact. And so, um. It's like this lens through which I try to, to like gain perspective on things. So if you're ever wondering, even if your business is making a difference beyond the 1% like that, it's so helpful to know that we can start there and, and see what happens after that.
Um, and so I, I did wanna talk to you a little bit more about actually the impact that, that your organization does make and, and. Who, who's kind of a part of the community that's being invested in, because I really love that, you know, when I'm looking through it, there's so many things are happening at a community level and like I feel like a lot of times money goes out into the world at the top and it doesn't get down to the level where.
It can be such a small amount and make such a small, a huge impact. Like we feel like we need to be giving like a million dollar grant to this and a and a X, Y, Z to that. And what I love about 1% from what I've seen and what I know is that like everybody gets to take a part of this and even better if the people on the ground are taking a part in making the change.
So that's kind of what I wanted to talk about with
Kate: Yeah. Yeah, I love that. And um, yeah, so, so the way we think about impact is we have four impact areas, just economies, resilient communities. Rights to nature and conservation and restoration. And you can probably hear in that that there's a very planet and people focus. Um, and you know, that impart ties to our purpose, which is to inspire action and commitment so that our planet and future generations.
Planet and people thrive. And then we also, you know, tied it to the UN Sustainable Development Goals and Project Drawdown and, you know, wanted to make sure it kind of aligned with some of the other kind of frameworks out there. But then, you know, the way those serve us is that every business member who's making donations, their donations are gonna land in one of those four categories as they flow through to the nonprofits who are like.
Um, positioned within, you know, one of those four categories and, um, and you're spot on in terms of the, like on the ground community, like localized support because one of the really amazing things about 1% for the planet that I think really is, makes it unique is, you know, we are. You know, C creating impact, delivering philanthropy at scale.
So to date, since we were founded in 2002, we've certified more than 800 million US dollars. We're on track to get to our first billion, and then we plan to accelerate to the next billion. And you know, for the most part, other donors who are giving at this scale, to your point, are. You know, an 800 million sort of portfolio is made up of really big donations.
A few really big donors for 1% for the planet. Our 800 million is hundreds of thousands of donations made through distributed decisions across our global member network. Each member is deciding where they're gonna give. We do have a point of view, you know, it all flows through these four impact areas, but you know, we're seeing gifts as small as a hundred dollars and is.
You know, hundreds of thousands of dollars, but they're going to often highly localized, uh, nonprofits that are, you know, addressing, you know, very real on the ground issues. We're not opposed to like supporting, you know, entity, the nonprofits that are, you know, addressing big global issues. But to your point, I think it's really, really important that, that, that there's a.
A sort of matching between interests, amount of giving, and you know, that sort of those on the ground needs.
Christine: Yeah. I think it, yeah, it, to me it just, it feels, and like you said, I love the word personalized because I feel like, um. That's one of the other really beautiful things is like you as a business can sit and look and say, what do I want my impact to be? And I think impact can be confusing sometimes. And this is just such a.
It, it takes that burden off of trying to figure out if you're doing it right or how I should do it and where I should do it. And um, that just reminded me lastly before we'll end up, but I just watched this, um, webinar was on this webinar earlier this week and, um, it had a Nobel laureate, um, uh, Al Carman.
Definitely not saying her name correctly. Um, and it was a part of the Soul of Money Institute, but she was saying that, um, businesses need to change kind of this idea that we were talking about and they have responsibility. And she said this sentence, um, that as soon as she said it, I thought of this conversation coming and she said, it's not charity, it's responsibility.
And I just, I just thought like. of how empowering that feels and it brought me back to, again, like 20 some years ago when the company I worked for had its corporate social responsibility platform. And then we kind of got away from that language and then I was like, but actually those were the perfect words because it is our corporate social responsibility.
I truly believe, and I love how 1% for the planet allows us to like. As a business, easily say, this is what I stand for, and not that I'm just putting this into this pocket. Like I, like you said, I can even take my values a little bit deeper and say, here's where I would love to be able to make a difference.
And so like that just, that makes me feel really watching that journey for businesses.
Kate: Yeah, and we, um, I absolutely align with that. Like it's not charity, it's responsibility. 'cause actually our founder, Yvonne Sheard is known for saying it's not charity, it's strategy. And we really, a lot of our work with members is helping them to see how when they become a 1% for the planet member.
If they've never done any philanthropy before, or if they have done philanthropy before, regardless what we're, you know, enabling them to do is to move it from either something they didn't do at all or something that was kind of like a nice to have at the end of the year if they had money left over into a strategic.
Tool that helps them to, you know, solve business problems, address like values, needs, um, tell a brand story differently and really become central to how they do their business. So it's, you know, you pay your rent, you pay your staff, and you pay the planet. And that's just kind of check, check, check. That's what you do.
So I'm, I love that that phrase is out there in different ways. 'cause I think it's so important that we really do. Change it from this extra into the core.
Christine: Yeah, I agree. And there was one other thing I, I had heard you talking about too is this idea that, um, that brands have the idea of being value forward with your contributions and the impact you're making, somehow tarnishes the impact you're making and, and. Trying to like change the narrative on that, like that your brand story is this values, I, I do think it really has changed, especially maybe in the last five years, but I still have this conversation a lot where like you can't tell people what your values are as a brand and then I'm like, but I only wanna shop with people whose with brands, whose values I know.
So I don't believe that to be true, but some people must. So I feel like there's an interesting conversation that's probably still happening there.
Kate: Yeah, I think it is very much a live conversation. And you know, if you think about the last five years, so from 2020 until now, like think of all the changes. Think of the, you know, how like marketplace expectations. And you know, which is always kind of interrupted signals, right? Like, we do this, these consumer insight surveys and they tell us that consumers want X, Y, Z, but then brands do X, Y, Z and maybe get like called out or you know, whatever.
And vice versa, consumers say, well, we're kind of skeptical that the brands actually doing that. So, you know, it's not a like perfect communication system. And the expectations on both sides I think have changed some, but I think you're absolutely right. The data is really clear that consumers given the choice, given clear, credible information that they can believe would be like, I would like to, you know, I would be loyal to that brand over that brand.
'cause they're, they actually represent a solution or they're actually doing something that's good or they align with my values and I understand how they do that. Um, so I think it's. You know, if you frame it as a conversation between, you know, within the marketplace, it's definitely a, you know, an ongoing one that seems to, you know, have some dysfunctions, um, embedded in it.
But that I think is continuing to progress If, um, you know, if in a sort of bumpy road.
Christine: Yeah. Uh, we could definitely dive deeper there, but the idea of trust, I think is important. And this sounds like a paid. Add, but it's not, but like, that's one of the things, if I see 1% for the planet, like I just go, okay, trust. Right? Like that's, again, it takes the burden off. I can just say, okay, I, I feel like that aligns with me.
They've at least taken that initiative. So I'm gonna use that as a, an easy decision making. Step for me. So, um, I, yeah, as we've already, we started and ended with me gushing about my fandom.
Kate: Well, it's great to hear that. I'm glad that, uh, trust is what comes to mind for you. That's great to hear.
Christine: Um, so I have one thing and then we have our rapid fire questions. I just want to tell our listeners, um, and I'll put this in the show notes so they can find out more that you, that 1% for the planet has their end of year challenge campaign, um, that is, has recently launched. Um, and that's, uh, would you like to gimme a one line on that instead of me explaining it, I guess.
Kate: Sure. Yeah. I mean, funding 1% for the planet enables us to. Build this big global network, and so now is a really important time to support us. And then you're also part of our community, which is a great thing. So we encourage you to do that. And we have some amazing donors who have put up a challenge and we're trying to match that right now.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you. Okay, the questions here are, what are you reading right now?
Kate: I am reading, um, a, I'm just about to finish a really interesting book called Fire Weather, um, by John Valent. It's about a big, burly fire in Northern Alberta and he is an amazing writer and. I learned a ton about fire, climate change, climate change history. So I am reading that I, I don't always read like hardcore work related books, but that one has been a really, he's a great writer again.
So it's a great book.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you. Um, what is always in your suitcase or backpack when you travel?
Kate: Uh, running, running shoes.
Christine: Um, what is something you eat that connects you to a place that you've been?
Kate: I am a big Sardines fan, um, and that I know that they're mostly associated with, uh, Portugal, but like I associate like kind of canned fish with the Scandinavian countries and my dad, 'cause that's where he was from, his family's from. And so we used to tease him about that. But now I'm, I'm the one who loves the salty canned fish.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you. Um, we didn't talk a lot about your own travels, but who was a person who inspired or encouraged you to travel in the world?
Kate: Probably my mom, she had loved travel and was such a like conversationalist and you know, always open to new experiences.
Christine: Um, if you could share an adventure with one person, fictional or real, alive or past, who would it be? I.
Kate: Uh, I get a, I would have to go with like every single person in my family, my immediate family, my husband, and my two kids. They're my absolute favorite travel companions each for different reasons.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you. Um, when you think about the, uh, phrase soul of travel, what does that mean to you?
Kate: I think that when we travel our. Sort of hearts and souls are become more open because we're in new places. Um, and so the soul of travel to me is, you know, just like allowing, being, allowing yourself to be changed by the openness that is available to you when you travel.
Christine: Thank you. Um, and the last question, soul of Travel is a place for celebrating women in the industry. Um, who is one woman in travel or in climate that you admire and would love to recognize in this space.
Kate: Um, I'm gonna go with Ayana Elizabeth Johnson. Um, she came out with a book a couple years ago called What If We Get It Right, and she's just a brilliant thinker about. Science and climate and oceans and, um, I just really like that question. And that's sort of a guiding question that pulls through a lot of her, like research and writing as opposed to like, we're gonna get it wrong.
What if we get it right? And then you kind of live a little differently. So that's an inspiration for me.
Christine: Yeah. Thank you. And thank you so much for taking the time to have this conversation with me. Um, I really have enjoyed being able to connect with you and, and hear your story today.
Kate: Well, likewise. Thank you so much.
Christine: Thank you, you.
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